Total and utter cheats!!

[Garawa]

It seems the rules put in place designed to ensure clubs stick within their means are utterly pointless as a small handful of clubs that are the worst offenders are the only ones able to get around it whilst even large clubs and all smaller than them are unable to do the same making the gap between them impossibly big.

I know I have spoke about this before but now I read that Man City paid £60 million to have a team in the USA who then brought in Frank Lampard on a free transfer. He was then subsequently "loaned" to Man City which has caused uproar from many quarters as it somehow floats the ruling about overspending. I'm not sure how but it seems to have angered Arsene Wenger! City want several clubs all over the globe effectively allowing them to "borrow" some of the best players and get round rules they significantly failed to adhere to.

If this is true then the rules need changing very quickly before we end up with only 4 clubs across the continent able to actually win anything....it is bad enough already.

[Rimshot]

You're right, but in an era when the boss of F1 can escape a bribery trial by paying another bribe, and the world cup venue is decided by backhanders are we surprised ?

Withe every passing year I 'm less and less interested in Premiership football ; Manchester World XI v North London Eurostars …who gives a flying f**k.

[Elgrande]

Trouble is most football fans are hypocrites. They will attack other teams for having money, but when someone with billions comes along all of a sudden all is fair. Man City used to bleat about Man Utd and their (self generated) money, but now they don't care that their club is owned by people who basically despise most things about the Western world apart from money and "prestige". Chelsea fans quickly forgot Matthew Harding when the destroyer of complete villages and exploiter of his countries national resources came along. The Scousers are now happy with a baseball fan owning their club and so it goes on.
I wonder how Gills fans would react if a Sabra Zionist or a friend of Putin came along and bought a few trophies?

[Garawa]

You are dead right but it seems all these rules are easily bypassed by the most wealthy of clubs and have little to do with the fans. Are the rules deliberately set to bias these clubs which then comes back to the potential corruption that Rimshot mentioned? If so then there is no hope unless we can overcome the organisations that run our game. Personally I think it is more to do with the clubs always having an answer to them and, if so, it must be fairly simple to ensure they are much tighter so it begs the question why do they seem so reluctant to alter them?

[Rimshot]

Elgrande since the entire ethic of the Sabra Zionists is predicated on the homeland and rejection of the diaspora they are probably the least likely foreign investors on the planet. Sometimes your obsessive rightwing agenda falls at the first hurdle !!

[Kent_UckyFriedGills]

I don`t like that Owners can buy more than one Club,as this is what happens.The owner can then sign a player he probably wouldn`t have signed without owning two Clubs.It seems a bit like Cheating to me.Lampard will be a good experienced signing for Man City,but they most likely signed him to just up their English Player Quota.Lampard would probably not have signed for Man City without the owners also owning New York City.He said he wouldn`t join another English Club,and he orginally didnt.Now he has because this was the owners plans.

[Elgrande]

Right wing agenda. I was just trying to find examples of people who would raise the hackles of many people in normal life, but would ignore them and / or their background / beliefs if their money bought their team success. Say the Le Pen family bought a club and invested a billion would the fans get al irate? Probably not. You despise Scally, but like many others probably celebrated our promotion to the 2nd tier?

[fan_of_mulligan]

Arsene Wenger is someone who has criticized the loan window in the past, he moaned that Everton signed Gerard Deulofeu, Romelu Lukaku, Gareth Barry and Lacina Traoré last season, he moaned when Manchester United sent Tim Howard and Ben Foster out on loan in the same season as these two could not play against Manchester United and he is also a manager who reluctantly uses the loan system to Arsenal's benefit.

Manchester City are not the first team to have feeder teams in other countries, although Manchester City's are more obvious with New York City and Melbourne City, Chelsea have Vitesse as a feeder team in The Netherlands and Manchester United have Royal Antwerp in Belguim, Financial Fair Play is very easy to bypass because if the clubs were to take Financial Fair Play to court they would win as there are so many loopholes and inconsistencies in the way Financial Fair Play is implemented, and while the spirit and the idea behind Financial Fair Play is fantastic and something we all want to see come in, actually putting those rules down in writing and making sure the sanctions are sufficient is the tricky part.

Can you really see UEFA Kicking Out Manchester City, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Manchester United or Juventus out of The Champions League for not sticking to financial fair play rules ???, I think squad lists will be cut and there will be a slap on the wrist but the loss of sponsorship money and not seeing players like Ronaldo, Bale, Yaya Toure, Aguero, Rooney, Van Persie, Messi or Neymar would hurt The UEFA Champions League more and these clubs will never be kicked out of The Champions League.

Although Manchester City have signed Frank Lampard on loan from New York City because this is The MLS Close Season, the other way around is more difficult because The A League and The MLS have strict wage policies, there might be 1 - 2 superstars per club but after that the wages drop dramatically and there is a list of requirements that a club needs to tick off successfully before joining The MLS - However with The Stadium Expansion, the huge investment in youth development and ownership of Melbourne City and New York City, Manchester City are building a strong business model which works for them, but it only works if you have the financial investment and if this is going to be a long term plan, the scary thing is that there is no limit to what Manchester City can afford, Real Madrid and Manchester United could spend masses amount of money but there always seemed to be a limit.

Even Crystal Palace had a feeder team in American Football called Crystal Palace Baltimore, but this team only ran for a few years - I don't think anything can be done about Feeder Clubs but maybe put a restriction on the number of feeder clubs one club could have, Manchester City and Manchester United have thirty feeder clubs combined between the two of them, some of the links are more obvious then others but that is way too many.

As The MLS And A League's continue to expand I can see Manchester United, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea adding feeder teams to these divisions, nothing in the rules stops these clubs from doing this, Watford exploited a rule a few years a go where a loan from another country was classed as a International Transfer so Watford loaned in 12 - 13 from Udinese and The Football League Closed this loophole up by changing the rules to, you can only loan four players from one club and these rules were only changed after Watford exploited the loophole.

I think this loophole is tougher to close, and chances are the big clubs can spend the big money to hire the best lawyers to find more loopholes if any rule was to come in, UEFA are in-charge of the clubs in Europe but they don't run The MLS or A League so it is difficult to bring in one rule which restricts Feeder Clubs all over the world when clubs in Spain, Germany and The Netherlands already have a system where they run B Teams in The Lower League's.

[Garawa]

Interesting. I guess they have always been in recent existence in one form or another but something needs to be done if it means the rules simply apply to 95% of clubs whilst the others laugh behind your back. I haven't got the answer but perhaps we need to redefine what a loan actually is which in turn would have a significant impact on teams like ours.

[Elgrande]

Can't understand why Man Utd are quoted in this as they generate their income, not get it from rich owners and never have?
So come on; a mega rich despot buys Gillingham and we go into the Premiere League what would you do? Stick to your principles or go to the games?

[Garawa]

I think the reference was how the club was perceived by fans as there was a significant "anyone but Utd" brigade out there.

We would of course go to the games. But therein lies a major issue. Coventry fans stuck by their guns and didn't go to games last season but would have still done so if they played at the Ricoh? We / they support the team and always will do despite what goes on off the field. It isn't really about that at all as I can never see me refusing to go based on some back ground issue. These rules need to be tightened before the game is lost entirely. It is an issue for the club owners and governing bodies not the fans.

As for how would I feel if these people took over the Gills? It seems I would have no say in the matter. If they were breaking all the rules it would inevitably lead to disaster and possibly them leaving the club virtually bust. I can't do anything about that but if I went to the games I could help stem the bleeding but putting money the clubs way. Many hate Scally, a couple refuse to go but what good does that do anyone and I suspect they wouldn't to games in any case!

[Rimshot]

I don't know Mr Scaly personally but everything about his approach to the club, the players, managers and supporters suggests he's an unprincipled self-server. He's been labelled as a Racist by a tribunal and all supporters know he lies through his teeth about ground ownership and developments, for example.
All this AND he bleeds the club of money .
When I go to GFC I go as a fan to support the team, not the Chairman. My support helps marginally to line his pockets which I resent but I can't control. If the club were to be taken over by someone like Le Pen or Murdoch it would be a different matter, because they have an avowed political position that I wouldn't associate with. I can't say I would cease to hope they won matches but i definitely would not support them on any practical level.
It might seem like splitting hairs and it's hard to draw a line between what's acceptable and whats not. Some things, however, are so far across the line that, like Lampard's goal, there's no decision to make.

[Garawa]

I agree. The only one that truly loses out is the fan missing out on watching the team they love. We can voice an opinion and hope someone listens but that is all we can do likewise hating a ruling government wouldn't / couldn't prevent you from using government services or buildings. You can complain but its tough luck if you're out voted!

I guess the only way to look at the Scally scenario is that another owner is likely to draw on a similar salary and whilst he may take a higher sum, the difference over the course of year is hardly likely to make much difference by staying away.